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Default QEV explained by MartinHimself (off Pbnation)
Unread 03-16-2005, 12:07 PM   #1
cjpmunoz
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This guy named MartinHimself made this post of pbnation.com, he explains the awe of the QEV mod:

Had some time after class and figured this might help some of you guys learn about QEVs and how they apply to your ION. Caution, extremely long.
BTW read about the grease bypass if nothing else, it is a huge boon to reliability.

The QEV explanation sheet
By: Martinhimself
I Have dealt with QEVs extensively in both cockers and now my ion. I hope this will clarify things for ION users wondering about performing this modification on their own guns. I will break it down into two categories, what QEV fits, and what advantages/disadvantages you will encounter.


1. What QE valves fit the ION? Any QE valve with 10-32 NC threads will fit the ION front bolt port. (You may have to take a Dremmel to the plastic body sleeve to make it fit, I had to when mounting a Pneumadyne QEV.). Any QE valve with a built in 1/8" inlet or provisions for mounting a 1/8" barb fitting will work (1/8" Outer Diameter, OD tubing. The list of QE valve I know will fit are as follows. (Eclipse, Pneumadyne, Clippard, WGP TRV with 10-32 threads only.) I have dealt with clippard, Pneumadyne and eclipse QEVs and prefer the Pneumadynes, although they are comparatively large. I have never had a Pneumadyne QEV leak, and I have had an Eclipse, and a Clippard leak, (although they may be isolated problems).
Remember, although you may be tempted to use locktite as a sealant don’t do it! When it comes time to disassemble the gun you will understand, they call it locktite for a reason. Even if you use the removable strength, the seal integrity will go down if you take the QEV off and simply slather more on when you re-install later (unless you THOUROUGHLY clean the threads!). What I have found works best is to cut a thin strip of Teflon tape (about 1/8" wide) and wrap it around the threads (A la standard air lines). Make sure you have the plastic body sleeve on before you install the QEV. You will need to cut the hose leading from the 3-way valve in the case of the long Pneumadyne or Clippard QEVs. If you botch the hose length remember that the hose between the solenoid valve and the front port is simply standard Autococker pneumatics hosing. Once you have this done, you can re assemble the gun, and begin reaping the benefit of a QEV.

2. What are the advantages/dis-advantages of using a QEV?
Increased bolt speed
Slightly better efficiency
Grease bypass (seriously read about this! It is at the end but worth knowing about)

First off you only need one QEV! It will hinder the performance of your ION if you put on two QEVs. The front port on the ION's aluminum reciever is the only one that should have a QEV installed on it. The reason for this is simple. The rear port is a one way port. What this means is that all that port ever does is try to fill the chamber. Since there is no exhausting through that tube, it would be useless, and also since the fill flow through a QEV is much less than the firing chamber tubing/banjo can support your fill rate will slowdown, resulting in drop off during rapid fire.
All a QEV valve does is allow the air holding the bolt back in the front chamber of your Ion escape more quickly. Instead of forcing the exhaust air back through the restrictive tubing to the valve it is instead dumped out a port with much higher flow capabilities than the tubing and small barb on the solenoid.
All of this extra flow equates to two things as far as the ION is concerned. Higher bolt transit speed, and raised air efficiency. Right now, the effects of the higher bolt transit speed manifests itself as an ability to lower dwell, or the time the solenoid must remain energized to complete a full cycle. A lowered dwell will equate to a shorter cycle time, which will equate to a higher achievable rate of fire. The one problem with this thinking for the time being is the fact that Smart Parts has put a rate of fire cap on the board. Even if your cycle takes less than 1/17 of a second the board will prohibit you from achieving 17 cycles per second. I am sure the aftermarket will come up with a fix for this in no time.
Then again a higher bolt transit speed will mean that for a given cycle the gun with the shorter dwell time will block the breech for a shorter amount of time during each cycle, making the gun easier to feed. IE an Egg may suffice when a Halo was the only thing that would keep up with rebound before the QEV mod. Also if the bolt speed is higher, it will also vent the air more suddenly allowing more air to affect the ball earlier on, slightly increasing efficiency. In my time with the mod I have noticed one downside to this increased bolt speed. When I originally performed the mod on my ION I also enlarged the transfer drilled in the front of the body. I matched it to the size of the smallest point of the exhaust side of the QE valve. When the gun was firing I was able to lower the dwell to the lowest setting the board would accept, while still reaching 300fps. All of this extra bolt speed increased the instance of paint breakage. What I believe to be the cause is the face of the bolt contacting the ball with such force that it cracks the shell of the ball. None of the breaks were due to chopping or paint/barrel match (as it would break an odd ball even when firing the gun without a barrel, and during single shots.). I am currently working on a way to tighten the gap between the bolt face and the ball so the bolt cannot reach such a high speed before contacting the ball. Perhaps you could pad the face similar to how the old Automags did it?
**Many people will be quick to point out that the efficiency goes up due to the fact that the dwell is lowered, that is wrong.**
The QEV only increases the transit speed of the bolt. The QEV allows the bolt to get to the full forward position faster that is all. It does not make it retract any faster. The latency or time it takes to switch from open to closed in the valve coupled with intake flow of the chamber is what determines how fast your bolt will retract, shutting off the air going down the barrel, a QEV does not influence these two factors. If you took a pair of IONs and equipped one with a QEV and one without and turned the dwell down as far as you could for each respective set up to attain a full cycle, the time the bolt would actually be the full forward position would be the same. The bolt in the ION equipped with a QEV would simply take less time to get to that position, consequently giving you a shorter cycle time. The efficiency bonus really comes from two factors at work when a QEV is added to the ION. First, the air in the chamber uses less energy exhausting gas and more propelling the ball due to the fact that the QEV has made the exhaust more efficient. Second, the ports that allow the air to go from the firing chamber to the bolt face are uncovered more suddenly. What this means is that more gas will hit the ball earlier in the cycle. Instead of a little trickle of air hitting the ball early in the valve opening and pushing the ball up slowly, more gas acts on the ball before it has expended its energy expanding to chase the ball down the barrel. Again though, you run into more stress on the ball when the gas hits it more suddenly.
The final most overlooked benefit.
(GREASE BYPASS) If anyone has looked at the solenoid they will have realized it is simply a metal armature riding in a bore wrapped with wire. So it only makes sense that less friction or liquid with a surface tension to break on the armature the faster and more reliably it will be able to shift (even in the manual it says explicitly not to lube the solenoid). Well, you will also notice that the exhaust air on a standard ion travels past this armature. Say you grease your ION, all of the excess grease that blows out the front chamber will eventually find it into the solenoid (notice your front tube turns cloudy soon, that is grease brother), coating the armature in sticky Dow grease or whatever love sauce you use on your gun. This will slow the solenoid down, and make it so you must run a higher dwell than if you kept a clean solenoid. When you put a QEV on it will redirect the exhaust gas through the port on the QEV and save your armature from grease buildup. This trait will make you able to run a low dwell much more reliably than you would be able to otherwise. It will also help you avoid first shot drop off, as a greasy solenoid will seat after a while and make it much harder for the armature to break the stickiness of the grease after a while.

For those that have stuck with me this far I thank you for listening to my rant, and I hope I have answered all your questions.
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Unread 03-16-2005, 12:27 PM   #2
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Interesting
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Unread 03-16-2005, 04:49 PM   #3
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this is a great mod
i encourage all Ion owners to take advantage

PS-check that your dremmel is pluged in...so you don't have to drive to a friends to use his.
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Unread 03-17-2005, 05:34 PM   #4
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wow...i need pics to understand lol!
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Unread 03-18-2005, 09:47 PM   #5
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sounds interesting..... if it makes your bolt move faster than what it is stock. is it possible to break the bolt??

how long did the mod take??

is this something i could do or would a air smith be able to do this.
possible to get detailed instructions (w/pics)

how much does a QE valve go for.

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Unread 03-18-2005, 11:17 PM   #6
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Quote:
Originally Posted by pntjnky76
sounds interesting..... if it makes your bolt move faster than what it is stock. is it possible to break the bolt??

how long did the mod take??

is this something i could do or would a air smith be able to do this.
possible to get detailed instructions (w/pics)

how much does a QE valve go for.

No, making the bolt speed increase won't make it break.
I'm willing to be that once you break down your gun to get to the hoses, it takes no more than 5 minutes.
You'd be able to do the mod with a little bit of common sense.
About $11
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Unread 03-19-2005, 08:38 PM   #7
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QEVs
Have yet to get one in my ION, but I have them on my Cocker... noticable difference on the ram speed... is it major no but you can tell a difference.

Now image a difference like that on an electro gun... 12.49 (my cost to purchase one qev from ebay) sounds like a good CHEAP upgrade... or experiment.

It cannot hurt for as far as I can see. Faster exhaust would actuallybe better for your parts if you ask me.
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Unread 03-19-2005, 09:57 PM   #8
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same here ya know pictures mean a thousand words and theres about 2 thousand and that would be easeily sumed up by 2 pics but its a great mod Definatly someithn to do
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Default QEV with Predator 2 board
Unread 03-22-2005, 01:39 AM   #9
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HMMM?!?!?! If the QEV is can make the bolt cycle faster and a Predator 2 board maxes out on the ION around 20 BPS, I believe that's what I read somewhere. What would happen with the two mods together?
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Unread 03-22-2005, 03:38 AM   #10
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you will shoot even faster...
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